Say a prayer, and let God sort it out
DEAR EDITOR:
Recently there have been salvos traded back and forth for and against gay rights. Christian against non-Christian or Christian against Christian.
Verses from the Bible have been thrown back and forth like bean bags at a Fourth of July picnic. Most Christians believe that God's law, the Bible, supersedes man's law, and like to say that homosexuality is against God's law. Well, I have to disagree.
Yes, God calls homosexuality an abomination and warns believers to avoid contact with these people. But that's not a law, that's advice. God's laws can be found in the book of Exodus written on two tablets of stone. Nowhere in the Ten Commandments is homosexuality even mentioned. To say that anything God says in the Bible is law is ridiculous.
Jesus came to free us from the law not enslave us to it. The case was made recently that God destroyed Sodom and Gomorra because of their lifestyle. Nothing could be further from the truth. God destroyed the two evil cities because he could find only one individual among thousands, maybe tens of thousands, who believed in Him. The cities were completely devoid of any love for God, save one man, Lot. If you don't believe me read the story for yourself, Genesis, Chapters 18 and 19.
To say that homosexuals are going to hell for being gay is to say that an alcoholic is going to hell for being a drunk. This just isn't so. Besides, there are true born-again Christians who are gay. What about them? To say that they are going to hell is to say that a straight Christian who smokes or drinks alcoholic beverages is going to hell also. That's not true either.
This is a complicated issue with a simple answer. If Christians think homosexuals are wrong, then they should pray for them, not with disdain, but with the love of God. Pray for them all, and let God sort them out.
Paul P. Lubianetzky
Howland
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RaiderinWesterville
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06-30-09 2:11 PM
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colleen - Good Luck!
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colleen
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06-29-09 8:29 AM
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Wait, what? Let me get this straight: different versions of the bible are written different ways??? No way. King James version is biased and discriminatory?? Yet you still want us to believe this collection of unreliably written (as Bob says) ancient stories is the final word on how human kind should live? Which version should one follow? No thanks, I'll pass. I think I know (without unreliable ancient writings) how to be a decent human being.
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TBTBTB
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06-28-09 4:55 PM
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Nobody asked you, reverend.
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BobCvengros
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06-28-09 4:48 PM
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The King James version of the Bible is very biased and discriminating. To read on-line is only a self-serving to those that publish, to interfere with our freedom of choice.
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TBTBTB
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06-27-09 8:44 PM
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Thanks JC (no pun intended). That was something I thought I remembered from waaaay back when I was growing up and going to church.
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JoeCool
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06-27-09 7:57 PM
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TBTBTB - The New Testament is God's new promise. Through Jesus Christ, we are sanctified. Jesus came as the ultimate sacrifice, thereby forever replacing the sacrifices required in times of the Old Testament.
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TBTBTB
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06-27-09 5:41 PM
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Hey Raider, No joke but I'm reading the Bible from cover to cover. (Not literally because I found the King James' version online, but you get my drift.) I figure it's about time and so far so good. I'm only about 1/4 of the way through, so I can't weigh in on the Biblical significance, but one thing I have noticed is that, just in the beginning of the Old Testament...there sure are a lot of rules that modern Christians don't follow, from something like the types of food we eat to stuff like observing Passover properly and eating leavened bread. How do you rectify all that? Honestly?
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Tristan
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06-27-09 8:38 AM
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Raider, are you saying you're above the "biblical law" and won't be judged as an equal to the rest of us mere mortals. If you believe in spreading the "biblical" view then you must accept it all, not pick and choose. I don't hear you condemning the many Republican Senators who have committed adultery and biblical law states they are to be "stoned to death."
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RaiderinWesterville
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06-27-09 1:22 AM
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TB - He knows how I feeel and he doesn't agree BUT he is my brother period. Tristan - You will answer some day and not to me. estimatedprophet - Whatever. You aren't worth arguing with. Everyone have a safe and great weekend!
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estimatedprophet
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06-26-09 11:29 PM
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Hey Bob - Why don't you clarify things for us already? You too, Raider - How does that marriage thing work again?
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TBTBTB
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06-26-09 6:15 PM
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Raider, I feel bad for your brother.
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Tristan
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06-26-09 5:59 PM
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Raider in Westerville: Since you like to quote scripture I have a few for you and please let us know if you follow them. According to Leviticus "farmers are not to reap to the edge of the field."? Would you put to death those who "shave their beards" or have "tattoos"? Both forbidden in Leviticus. Do you believe "slavery" is ok, women are "property" of men and "adulterers" be put to death? If any of your friends or family read horoscopes would you "stone" them? Finally, if you were in a room that I entered, would you follow the directive of Leviticus, "Rise in the presence of the aged."
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colleen
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06-26-09 5:15 PM
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Therein lies the problem, Raider. You believe the bible is some holy, sacred word. I don't. Yet you feel I have to follow it. Again, you are imposing YOUR views and beliefs on ME. All legal unions should be called civil unions. If you want to be 'married', then along with your civil union, make the effort in a church -- IF that's what you believe in. My children can camp with, be taught by and befriend homosexuals. Perhaps one of my children may be homosexual. Who knows? But I will love and accept them no matter what. However, my children can't camp with pedaphiles and/or religious right wackos.
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RaiderinWesterville
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06-26-09 4:27 PM
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"...For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh. So then, they are no longer two but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let not man separate." Matthew 19: 5-6 (quoting from Genesis 2:24) The definition of marriage IS that it is between a man and a woman . People have tried to change the definition and most states have had elections and the people have voted not to change it. There is no reason why people want to fight this if gay people can have the same rights without calling it marriage. My only objections are marriage, adopting children and things like the whole Boy Scout fiasco. People have a right to not want their children camping with homosexuals. The only thing I can do is to continue to vote against it and tell as many people as I can how wrong gay marriage is. People like you Colleen make me want to fight even harder. YOU are the one who wants to redefine marriage.
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colleen
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06-26-09 2:44 PM
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Marriage as defined by whom???? You??? Maybe MY definition of marriage does include members of the same sex marrying. I don't impose my views on you yet you want to impose yours on others by saying only 'these' kinds of people can get married and 'those' kind can't. And I have said repeatedly that others may believe what they want (for you gay marriage is wrong) but not impose it on others - which is what you are doing by defining marriage as only between a man and a woman. TB - nativios comment to Bob made me smile. Bob's reply made me laugh. I'm sure Bob will appreciate your clarification!!
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TBTBTB
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06-26-09 2:18 PM
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I really don't. I'm not trying to pick a fight but clarify things.
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RaiderinWesterville
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06-26-09 11:54 AM
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colleen - I have a brother who is gay also and it is still wrong. I'm sorry about your brother's health. I have repeatedly stated that I have no problems with civil unions that give many of the same rights but not marriage. Call it something else because marriage defined as being between a man and a woman. The problem with many people is if a person does not agree with gay marriage then they are haters or they are discriminating. TB - You are just trying to pick a fight because you know what I mean. You can drill a hole in a piece of wood and call it your partner or whatever but I don't need to know about it and you can't marry it.
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TBTBTB
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06-26-09 11:16 AM
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I'm not so sure it was a compliment.
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BobCvengros
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06-25-09 11:08 PM
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navito289 thank you for the compliment
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colleen
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06-25-09 10:09 PM
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Wow, 'stop spreading the disease of homosexuality'. That's nice, Bob. I wasn't aware that homosexuality was a disease nor that it could be spread. I am aware though that Bob has made a full-time job of posting his ignorance on many blogs. Raider - 'as long as no special treatment is given due to being gay'. You must mean that gay couples should not be given the same rights as hetero couples. Giving homosexual couples the same rights does not give them preferential treatment in any way; rather it treats them the same as all others. My brother is 60 years old, just found out he has terminal brain cancer. He's being cared for by his life partner. Yes, he's gay and he's been with Jimmy for years and years. They don't bother anybody, they don't ask for special treatment. I guess that doesn't matter in Raider and Bob's worlds.
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TBTBTB
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06-25-09 5:19 PM
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And finally, my comment at 12:13 was in response to Bob saying something somewhat nasty and then typing the word "BOY," even going as far as to offset the word with commas. You will notice that I used the word "BOY" as well at the end of my comment to highlight what Bob had done, which was to use a term from the days of segregation in order to intimidate someone. Folks, believe me, I have an interest in seeing Warren well-represented. As the city goes, so will the surrounding areas (where I live.) I now realize that I do not want to see someone as ill-informed, ignorant, and untruthful as Bob appears to be in a position with any sort of power. Especially if that position in any way deals with "African-Americans" in his constituency. I have a hard time believing that Bob will represent "African-Americans" to the best of his abilities. I have no ties to any campaign or any candidate anywhere in the local area, and never have. I simply can't abi
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TBTBTB
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06-25-09 5:15 PM
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If you examine the comments under the letter to the editor "Residents show signs of laziness" from June 12, 2009, you will notice my postings. Bob's comment that was removed was posted just prior to my comment at 12:07 on 6/20. My 3 comments from 12:07-12:13 were direct responses to Bob. If you examine my comments, you can see what I was responding to, unlike Bob who has a hard time responding to anything specific. In his comment, Bob assumed I was African-American (I am not) and that I do not support myself financially (I do). He mentioned how certain groups of people were bringing America down. If you examine previous comments in that article, you will get the tenor of who he was referring to. Bob also went on to post about Africa essentially being some backwards, in the dark continent where they could not even get water from the ocean for their basic needs. Bob grasps a basic knowledge of the difference between fresh water and salt water.
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TBTBTB
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06-25-09 5:09 PM
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What Bob doesn't realize is that I'm not a Warren resident. I don't live in the 4th ward. I don't know who's running for that seat. I have no other real-life acquaintances on this website to my knowledge. He is totally backpedaling because he now realizes that his comments on this website could be particularly damning should someone do a little research. As nativio pointed out, you can gather Bob's stance on a variety of issues based on what he posts in these comments. I'd like to point out that Bob, who claims he is being smeared, felt the need to put "African-Americans" in quotes. My reason for continuing to challenge Bob is so that he understands that if he is going to blather on and on and make nearly uninformed and/or bigoted, racist comments, then he is going to be challenged on these comments. I'll show my responses to something Bob posted that was removed due to racist content.
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nativio289
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06-25-09 4:34 PM
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Don't worry, you're doing a fine job of representing yourself and your thoughts. Anyone who can read and comprehend will have no problem of seeing exactly how you stand on the issues you type on.
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BobCvengros
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06-25-09 3:48 PM
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I forgot to add that when they respond to this comment and name call and bash, and whatever else they do, I will not respond, to keep you fine people from having to endure what I am. CASE CLOSED. (this one did deserve a double click).
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